Lived Experience Forum

[Former-Member]

Don't want to be glum, for the good news far outweighs the bad ATM!!! But my VC came Tuesday (sometimes i think she just needs to go 'off' at someone), she lectured me again about missing so much church (even though I told her I don't like travelling out of town and prefer to visit the local Anglican and their mid week groups. She prattled on about how she's been "coming here to visit me almost every week since my girl died and not going to her church more us like a SLAP IN THE FACE (that part really get to me), I could never repay her for all that she's done but don't want my choice of church dictated by 'payback' either. Its a troubled small group that I can't get into now, and I've tried to befriend each one of the ladies with little response. My VC doesn't get that I want to be part of their life, not just locked into that 2hrs a week. She thinks that's too much to expect when everyone's so busy 'workin' when I am not. I joked "God forbid anyone does something without getting paid for it" That was a mistake, got a tongue lashing over that one too. aother "slap in the face" she said. Oops! They all have money in the church, they're own fine homes, property, private health cover, cars, bikes, water skis, holidays overseas and everywhere (another reason they don't have time for me). When I suggested that perhaps giving up some assets might allow them to work less hours (no time for others, burned out, health woes etc), well, I got blasted. I reminded her people lice in grass huts and have time for each other and that I manage on less than 400 here by myself. Oh no, another blast!!! "Well you don't have to pay taxes" blar blar blar. She might be my only visiting friend, but honestly?? Is she right? Have I got it all wrong? What happens to love and praying together and truth? I am within my rights not to travel out of my own to church. I've always wanted community, am wrll enough for it now and doubt I'll find it when I live away, especially with my car playing up. A couple of the others have expressed concern I'll go somewhere with wrong teaching. Its a hard call. I don't like how they already know my business all the time and form opinions. The widow I've befriended (now she's retired) has felt tawn between the group and going elsewhere with her daughter and grandchildren. Safly she feels the same as me. She lives 5min away from them and shocked me recently when she said not one of them visited her after her husband died (she's felt so left out of the click apparently), he was the talker. I asked her what her husband would say to do? It was lime a lightbulb went off in her head and she is happy now going to church with her daughter (my bad?)

Anyway, my VC visit was a negotiation of understanding and she thinks we'll never agree on the matter (still not quite sure exactly what that really is). I reminded her I see her as a friend and a sister on the Lord, and could never repay these years of her watching over me when NO family could in my time of need. Maybe we can agree to disagree I suggested, but even that was buffed. As she left she said with relief "well I'm glad we had this conversation" Hmm, it was a reflex, tongue in cheek I said "feel like you've put me in my place do you?" She huffed off at that and didn't wave as she left. She hasn't answered my ladt tx or let me know where church was if I wanted to go (they meet in homes, it changes nearly every week).

I don't know how to process it. It feels like I've lost a friend, my only visiting friend really. But somehow I'm not desperately anxious about it as before (being alone), built up other supports maybe, but its sad, and it hurts that she's angry with me rather than loving.

All the times I have lovingly nurtured her as a friend and sister in the Lord, all the health advise (nursing), even thought she has husband and two adult daughters and family in the church. All the times she called in here after work offloading the day's stress when I myself was so desperate to talk (lonely) but couldn't. And all the coffees I made her.

Now, it seems I was a church charity case (not a friend and its hurting), a 'duty' that's dropped like a hot brick if I stop going there. What's with that? Like my sister disowning me - I don't know how this is so if they cared. Its not as if I'm abusive etc. Me sad.

Anyway, any thoughts on the matter? Am I doing wrong? My VC also lectured me several times declaring me 'disobedient' to God, 'rebellious' even, to miss church so much (I don't see the need for every Sunday).
Thanks for listening, opened a can of worms I think 🙂

[Kurra]

Hi @Former-Member
My God is a loving god. He doesn't judge me or love me according to how often I go to church. He accepts me as I am.
My friends from church accept me as I am and love me as one of the fold unconditionally.
My belief is that the ways in which I live my life, the ways I help other people without any expectation of any reward or brownie points in the after life.
I honour my god through my life and the caring and sharing, the compassion I give to all peoples regardles of their personal beliefs, nationality, the colour of their skin or their specific religious philosophy.
Conditional acceptance and 'love' are not and never will be a part of my philosophy of life.
Hugzzz 💕 🎶

[Appleblossom]

@Former-Member I hear you in your assertion of your dignity in the relationship. 

ALWAYS we have the right to dignity in a relationship ..as an ethical and christian or non-christian reality.

I am not sure what you mean when you call her VC .. is that like a pastoral worker .. a spritual director??

I laughed at your quip about .. God forbid anyone ... doing something without getting paid .... I struggle with the same social issues.

Maybe it will be another grief but a small one .. weigh up the relationship ... maybe say goodbye to her in your mind.. they filled an interim need .. when you were still traumatised by your loss .. you dont need to lambasted by such people ... I know what it is like being dangled as a charity case .. its not genuine charity ...

Bereavement support is traditionally offered by churches .. I was afraid that they would thrust innappropriate and outdated ideas on people .. There are so many interpretations of the bible .. there are a range of teachings ..  I was trained bereavement support .. but actually nobody wants my bereavement support because they can pick up I am more bereaved than them .. and that hurts both of us .. so I use the trainings to heal and understand myself... and stuck to opshop work and delivering food vouchers or arranging for furniture and other needs... kept my contribution practical.

I know the whole

Indignant "I pay taxes" .. BS .. well most of them try to minimise it when it suits them .. dont worry and then get on their high horse when it suits too .. I am over it all.

We actually do not need that much money to survive and social pretension is not a good enough excuse for me.

I would have prefered to work fulltime .. during my life .. and really .. in a way I have .. with all my different types of volunteer work.

Even though you may have received a tongue lashing .. shake it off .. like water

I believe it was good .. that you made points about the difference between spirituality and material success.  That is Jesus' teaching in the gospels ...its not that tricky ..that they need to worry about correct t4eaching .. I'm RC and they used carry on that all protestant teaching is wrong .. these days genuine religious people are inclusive ...  if we have been isolated and felt dependant on the goodwill of others .. maybe we need to be able to articulate our own true beliefs without fear.

Sad ... wish we did not have to struggle with such attitudes in christian communities .. but they are also out there in the arts and sports clubs and even universities of the 3rd age .. its their lack of compassion .. it feel worse in christian communities becasue we also have such idealised views about .. love and goodness and the virtues .. it is good to dream .. but perhaps admit that we all fall a bit short .. does not mean you need to degrade yourself to keep being whipped ..

Often success is random .. accumulation of many privileges .. and some work and luck .. but really ..

big deal .. We know what Jesus said about the rich getting into heaven.

Like you .. I need to guard myself from the insidiousness .. of other people's inability to be kind and understanding.

Some people like demanding "commitment" .. I had one in  a choir last year .. and it wasnt even a church choir .. and her psychiatrist offsider - copresident .. was disappointed in her treatment of me .. I ran into him singing a People's Messiah .. in a Baptist church .. where all proceeds went to the homeless ..

Stick with your core values .. charity is still important .. but we should not feel we are "a case".

I wish I had your nursing tips @Former-Member .. its easier now with the internet .. but when my kids were young .. I thought they were skills .. worth their weight in gold.

[Former-Member]

Thanks guys, big topic, taps into many issues but slowly learning none of it matters at the end of the day. Let it go. I've put an application to work at the local op shop so see how that goes. Hope to join the craft group too and continue ladies bible study. I'm thinking the Lord might take me home this coming year, not sure why, but then again when I was young 30 was old and I wasn't gonna make 50.

Talking about churches, I have a real issue with COMMUNION AND SHARING THE CUP, especially at the end of the line. Take my own now, always taught my kids to not share drinking cups. Not only that, its fed to you by a big old man in a dress with his hands still on it. Not comfe with that at all (my background is pentecostal, Salvo, Pres, Baptist, COC but mostly heavy pentecostal conditioning. Learning to value mainstream structure and compassion. The other trigger my emotional imbalance. I use to be strong buy even depression is often viewed as 'a choice' a 'lack of faith' or a result of sin.


Hi @Kurra, you nearly recovered? missed you this last few days 🙂

[Kurra]

Quite a way off full recovery @Former-Member. I'm still extremely weak with very low blood pressure and oh so tired. The doc said it will take a minimum of 3 months. I've got to have another biopsy 7 March.
I start leave for a month on Thursday so that will be a huge relief.
Take care 💕🎶

[Zoe7]

@Former-Member @Kurra @Appleblossom

Firstly I'll say that I have no firm beliefs so cannot put myself in your shoes in any way.

What I do believe is that any religion, any spirituality, any beliefs are an individuals' right to hold. How one chooses to affirm their faith is THEIR choice.

Secondly, anyone who wants to take without giving and then defends their actions, berates others and/or places conditions on their support/friendship has issues that they have to sort out for themselves. A true friend is one who can see past their own beliefs and views and see those of others - they don't have to necessarily agree but they do need to acknowledge that you have the right to think/believe/feel what you are.

Don't let the insecurities of others influence how you want to live your life.

Accept that sometimes moving forward also means moving on.

Have faith in your 'faith' and do want feels right for you to stay emotionally balanced.

Lots of hugs 

[Appleblossom]

Glad you are making plans that are closer, viable and meaningful for you @Former-Member.

Re cups .. I smother a laugh re infectious disease issues ..and I dip the bread .. the lady in front of me was very steadfast in her right to continue to dip when recently there was a LAW issued from on high .. but just the hierachy .. that said we all had to drink .. but I got in trouble when visiting my brother's old church .. didnt bother me though .. I cant believe in such petty laws.

My old Uniting Church had dinkie .. inidividual mini glasses and holes in the pews to sit them in ..

wow .. thats organised.

@Kurra Glad you will get some rest.

[Former-Member]

hello@tawney

I dont consider myself religious but i am spiritual. I believe that their is a higher essence that is intangible.

This has many forms and meanings for each of us as we are all unique.

many beliefs are followed, buddhism, hinuism. zen buddhism. roman catholicism, english cathlocism. mormans. assemblies of god, uniting church and many many more.

my understanding is that all have basic things in common love and respect.

You were helped at a time when you most needed it and were extremely grateful and continued to follow the faith. Whoever helped you then had been helped themselves at one stage by someone else and so on. You owe noone. you can choose to show love and respect. you do that on here. you show compassion and empathy.

the person who visited you did not show those things. That person is lost. That person is not your concern.

perhaps you have been given a sign of one door closing and another about to open. a change in direction on the road you are travelling. a new beginning.

you sound very wise when i read your posts. dont let that person who is lost confuse you.

read all the words you have written to others, all the love and respect you have shared.

you have done nothing, absolutely nothing wrong and owe noone any explanation.

you can choose to live your life in the way that you want to guilt free. you are loved on here Tawney. That stands out a mile.

well done girl. you go for it. love and hugs xxx

[Former-Member]

Oh shucks @Former-Member, you made me teary, good tears, thank you, and thanks so much for the validation on here too. I do try. I'm glad you are spiritual, seeking God which I know will be honoured. I like the Grace aspect of Christ as deep inside I feel so tarnished and the cross takes that away when I submit to it. I hope things work out with your family and Christmas isn't too hard for you. Be gentle with yourself 🙂

[Former-Member]

hello @Former-Member

see

i dont have to say a word

you said it all

that is who you are tawney, loving and respecting others, caring and compassionate.

i have mixed feelings about the day but will do my best to enjoy it for the people I am with because they matter too.

hope christmas day is everything that you want it to be too . xx